|
Responses to
the "Open
Letter to Mike Bickle"
(With my dialogue
with them when applicable.)
updated 1/14/08
Click
here to see the POSITIVE ones
Click
here to see the NEUTRAL or
Questioning
ones
Click
here to see the NEGATIVE ones
Be aware that if
you are an "elder" and you send me an email that doesn't at
ALL sound like Jesus, I reserve the right to post it publicly.
Because 1 Tim. 5:20 says you're supposed to rebuke me publicly. So
even if you do it privately, I reserve the right to make your rebuke
of me public. I'm all about transparency!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Posted on
our Discussion Board here 1/14/08 - http://repentancenow.yuku.com/topic/1252
IHOP Kansas
City error
Approximately 3
years ago my son told me he was going to 'study to be in the
ministry' (I was thrilled) and that he would be doing this in Kansas
City, MO. The International House of Prayer. I was so happy that my
child wanted to become a minister. How many parents have gone through
this? -The joy, the thrill, the thumbs up attitude?
Well my husband
told me that he had researching IHOP. He further went on to say that
after researching International House of Prayer - IHOP - in Kansas
City, that it was his determination that IHOP was NOT a good thing. I
was furious - not at IHOP but rather, my husband for even thinking
that our son would ever fall into something that wasn't Christ
centered! I mean, our kid loved Jesus. He'd never fall for something
that wasn't of God!
So I went to
Google, typed in 'IHOP' and 'cult'. I was going to prove him wrong!
After researching IHOP for the next three weeks I told him that I was
in a state of total disbelief. IHOP had all the ear marks of being a cult.
Well I was
saddened by what I'd learned but I still knew my son and I just KNEW
that he'd be interested in what I'd learned and would probably not
want to stay in it after he did his own research. So... I called him
up and told him that I had been doing some research and that I had
some serious reservations about what I'd learned about IHOP. I also
told him that I felt it looked like it may be a possible cult.
It was at this
point in time that I noticed that he was no longer calling me. No
longer e-mailing me. No longer returning phone messages or e-mails.
It was as if he'd fallen off the face of the planet. This went on for
about 2 months. So... one Saturday morning I jumped my car and drove
3 hours to Kansas City. To make a long story short, I hadn't been in
his home for 5 minutes and he was yelling at me, saying "YOU
JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND" at the top of his lungs. It was at this
point in time that he told me to leave his home. It was a long and
sad drive home.
After some serious
prayer, I contacted one of the people WAY HIGH at the top of the IHOP
ladder asking them if they would please get my son to communicate
with me again. I explained the whole thing from the beginning. I
promised that I would not say anything negative about IHOP or try to
get my son to leave. I just wanted to 'have a relationship with my
son again'. This person wrote back saying he'd 'get with him'. I was
glad I'd asked him to do that...
A week went by and
I received an e-mail from my son. He said he'd received 'older and
wiser counsel' (at IHOP) and had decided that I was to receive NO
communication (no e-mails, letters or visits) for 'one year.. at
least'. This was back in September. Next week will begin the fourth
month of silence.
My conclusion
about IHOP at this time is this: that Christ centered ministries
encourage their members to honor their parents and that Christ
centered ministries do not recommend their members cut off
communication with those who love them. i.e. that IHOP is not
behaving as a Christ centered ministry with regards to how they've
recommended my son cut off all ties.
I am praying God
would lift the veil of deception off my son's eyes. Allow him to
truly see the error in what he's hearing/learning. GOTW, Bridal
Pardigm, Harp and Bowl - error. No one is going to 'hasten' the
return of our Lord Jesus. Not by any means. I could go on and on.
Lord! Please
remove the veil of deception from his eyes!
p.s. IHOP has
sessions noting 'signs and wonders'. My Bible says: An evil
generation seeks after signs and wonders..
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Posted on
YouTube 6/27/07
That place freaks
me out, remember when Jesus said "If anyone says to you look
over here" or "Here He is here in the inner rooms" do
not go and do not believe. Well I had a friend say to me "Jen
you gotta see what God is doing out here, you gotta come out here
jen" - your right it has started Praise YHWH! Eeek Mahesh Chavda
was at that place run, run like a mad man! Good job dear :-) Great letter.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Subject:
about 'the call' and ihop
From: "William"
Date:
Thu, July 5, 2007 3:44 am
To: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Doug,
First thank you
for having the courage to speak out the truth. As Christians we
should guard against teachings that are even a tiny bit off from the
truth for my pastor told me that if a pilot sets his course even a
milimeter off course in the beginning; at the end of your journey you
could arrive in a completely different country than you planned to go.
That being said, I
shall add my testimony to what God has placed on my heart about 'the
call'. I too had checks in my spirit about Nashville's "the
call". At first I was so excited about it because it
sounded so awesome to fast and pray with my brothers and sisters for
our country....repent for our nation...and be a part of a movement in
history. Then I prayed about it and asked for discernment.
Every time I asked God if this was His "call." I got
a very strong "NO". I then read the brochure they put
out for the event and noticed the people on the cover who all have
guitars in their hands, appeared to be more angry than praising
God. The largest word on the cover was "music" which
I found odd.
Once reading about
the statement I was deterred most strongly because Jesus was only
mentioned a couple of times and the power of His crucifixion and
resurrection was not even mentioned. He was more put on an
equal level with the prophets Moses, and Elijah. I knew in 1
John 4:1-3 (NIV) it says
1 Dear friends, do
not believe everyone who claims to speak by the Spirit. You must test
them to see if the spirit they have comes from God. For there are
many false prophets in the world. 2 This is how we know if they have
the Spirit of God: If a person claiming to be a prophet[a]
acknowledges that Jesus Christ came in a real body, that person has
the Spirit of God. 3 But if someone claims to be a prophet and does
not acknowledge the truth about Jesus, that person is not from God.
Such a person has the spirit of the Antichrist, which you heard is
coming into the world and indeed is already here.
I know this is a
really strong statement and I am just applying the statement to what
is written about "the call" in what many have just cut and
copied onto their blogs and webpages. I also did not like the
statement about God giving a "prescription" for pouring out
His spirit. Fast for fourty days for fourty years and then God
will pour out His spirit? That sounds like we can manipulate God.
My discernment was
also preempted by my attending a conference called "Signs and
Wonders" at Kansas City IHOP a few months back with Mike Bickle
and Bill Johnson. I went with 3 other friends and we all were
surprised at the lack of love in the place. For instance during
one of the speakers at a packed house a pregnant woman looked for a
seat and NO ONE offered her a seat...even the staff? The praise
and worship team sounded great but never smiled like some rule
governed them not to smile?
My friends and I
were rebuked many times in the 24 hour prayer room in very cold
ways. If we dozed off we would immediately be awoken. We
could not even whisper to one another and the name "JESUS"
was hardly used ever in any of their songs...instead they addressed
'the spirit' or 'the river' or something more general. Again,
no one smiled and actually one team of worshipers that seemed to have
a joyful spirit were replaced with another somber one...it was all
very strange.
I got very COLD
SHIVERS when Mike Bickle was filmed on stage talking about GOD TV and
how companies had paid and were going to pay millions and millions of
dollars to place IHOP 24/7 tv in homes all over the world. He
had a very prideful spirit and God at that point asked me to leave
the room. I was on the second row and could feel Mike's disdain
and stares from the crowd as I quietly left the room. Many came
at me with harsh words after asking how I could be 'SO
JUDGMENTAL'. It was all very strange how defensive the whole
movement had become.
I left the
conference and came back to my hometown with an opressive spirit on
me. I knew it was the same spirit I had seen on others at IHOP
and I had to ask forgiveness and be broken from it. It wasn't
easy. Looking back I see the spirit as being very devisive to
the body of Christ and one of works and not grace.
My friends and I
are holding a praise and worship in the park in Atlanta on 7.7.7. and
having a feast with the homeless that night. We have been
praying for our city and hope for many to show but are leaving that
up to God.
So that is MY
testimony to MY experience and I pray that EVERYONE involved in
"the call" and IHOP would be blessed with disernment and
love so that the body of Christ can be of ONE accord.
In Christ's love
and the fear of the Lord I write this to you,
Billy
+++++++++
On 7/5/07,
doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
<doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com> wrote:
Hi Billy,
Thanks so much for
writing. My experiences with people from IHOP is the same (or worse).
And not just them, it has spread all over town to The Rock and the
Boiler Room and Solomon's Porch and a whole bunch of other ministries
that are closely associated with them. I get emails from people all
of the country saying their youth leader or worship leader went and
DID NOT come back the same - and not in a good way.
May I put your
email (with or without your name) here? http://www.fellowshipofthemartyrs.com/mike_bickle_responses.htm
People need to
hear this. I don't mind if I'm the lone voice out front, but I know
there are MANY others. If just the prophets that were sent in there
to rebuke Mike over the years all spoke in one place and told the
stories of how they were handled, it would be overwhelming!
I know it sounds
crazy, but you ask God. I was called to do what Mike didn't finish.
God has shown me how to restore the City Churches and given me the
keys to revival, personally and corporately. And whatever I have, I'm
happy to share with any that ask. There's lots on the website. You
might read the "Do It Yourself City Church Restoration"
book. I'm working on audios now.
You're not alone.
There are MANY out there that are seeking revival in a holy way.
We're also having an event on 7/7/7 out in the city park feeding the
homeless. :-) It's not about getting His attention and getting
Him to pour out His Spirit, it's about US showing that WE are willing
to pour out what we ALREADY have!
Love you. Stay in
touch. May the Lord Jesus Christ richly bless you with a great big
cup of HIM!
Doug
++++++++++
Subject:
Re: about 'the call' and ihop
From: "William"
Date:
Thu, July 5, 2007 2:32 pm
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Thanks Doug!
Of course you can
put my response up! I wish I had had your support earlier when
all of my friends attacked me for not caving on this issue.
I cannot wait to
read all about your church and revival!! After writing you last
night I woke up this morning with a weight off my chest:))
Our group will
pray for you and please ask God to bless our night of 7.7.7as I am
allowing Him to lead us and I hope we will have a great turn out.
peace bro,
Billy
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
Neutral
or Questioning Responses |
Subject:
A question concerning IHOP
From:
"Brian"
Date:
Wed, June 27, 2007 11:42 pm
To: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Hello my name is
Brian and I have a question concerning your post about the IHOP and
Mike Bickle. I have listened to your posts several times and
haven't heard you say anything concerning the doctrine that they
teach in IHOP. More clearly, the Bridal Paradigm. Do you
think that their doctrine about being passionately in love with Jesus
is wrong? I would like to hear what you think about this issue
of doctrine.
++++++++++
Subject:
Re: A question concerning IHOP
From: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Date:
Thu, June 28, 2007 3:05 am
To: "Brian"
Hi Brian,
I can't fit into a
10 minute audio all the things I find wrong with IHOP. The worst of
all is that they are under a curse from God. He has turned them over
to a strong delusion and a lying spirit from the throne that is
intent on their destruction. This is a judgement from God for having
gone their own way. Read the "Red Dragon" book (or listen).
You have to
understand that it's not that they're not hearing God. Every way they
know how to test the spirits, it will check out. But the application
or interpretation of what you're hearing will be mangled. Across the
board, from the city church, to this bride thing, to church
heirarchy, to 24/7 prayer - ALL the major stuff they're hearing is
mangled. It's not that God doesn't like prayer, or that He isn't
raising up a last days army, it's just that they have made it all
about THEM and twisted up into a denomination of their own. And a
really prideful one at that.
Should we be
passionately in love with Jesus. Yes. I am. Should we constantly
speak wistfully of Him kissing our necks and caressing us and
whatever. Yeah, I'm thinking not. The error is the lack of balance.
There is no FEAR OF THE LORD. Why fear a lover?
Is Jesus my
husband? Yes. Does He love me? Yes. Does He love me passionately?
Yes. Do I love Him passionately? Yes. But I have to ALSO understand
that He is an awesome, mighty God and a KING. And you don't go
grabbing the King's butt and winking at Him. You bow humbly and wait.
Jesus showed His love by His complete obedience not by His romantic
poetry about being raptured by God His lover.
The thing with
IHOP is that it is a FAR sneakier dragon than Toronto or some snake
handlers in Appalachia. Like the Purpose Driven Life dragon, it
seems to make some sense and look Biblical, but the application is
all wrong.
What if God told
them to stop the music and praying and go feed the orphans downtown
one day. Would they go? No. They can't. They've been doing this for
seven years and they're on a roll. They HAVE to keep the music going
or God won't send revival. Do you see how that's all about works and
"religion" and legalism? God doesn't want "harp and
bowl". God wants FAITHFULNESS in prayer. And God wants people
that stand before Him cleaned out. I can't even get a single tear
loose inside IHOP. It's practically impossible to repent in there -
and I cry A LOT!! I was there twice in three years and the last
time I was there, God forbade me to be on the property anymore.
I don't know if
that answers your question. Feel free to keep talking. I want to be
transparent and help however I can.
Love you.
Doug Perry
+++++++++++
More on the
history and links to writings of other people here:
http://www.intotruth.org/kcp/kcp-roots.html
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Comments
about the newsletter I sent out to my list that had some additional comments.
Subject:
RE: Letter to Mike Bickle - Solemn Warning about "The Call"
From: "Candy"
Date:
Fri, June 29, 2007 5:55 pm
To: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Hi Doug
Wow...I believe
the Lord is in this concerning IHOP, Mike Bickle (and other
minister/ministries that have gone off as well), and "The
Call"...I have known about Andrew and what God had originally
sent him here for as well and how that eventually got derailed
too...I know that saying these kinds of things are not fun or easy to
do when God leads us to do so..I believe God is lifting the skirts as
you said...alot of people don't necessarily agree that this is God's
way because they have all been taught to pervert the scripture that
says "love covers a multitude of sins..." as a weapon to
stop exposing where satan and his servants are hiding to destroy
multitudes of God's people all in one shot....For the most part I did
agree with the majority of things you said concerning Mike Bickle,
IHOP and The Call...But there were somethings that you need to be
aware of if you want to come across more affectively to those who
need to hear the truth concerning the delusions they are under and
encouraging others to participate in as if it is not there and all is
okay in God's eyes... I will list the things you said in this news
letter and the letter to Mike Bickle that I felt were not what Spirit
of God wanted to be said...
"Believe me,
this is NOT "fun" for me to pick a fight with the local Goliath."
This statement
would have been fine if you would have left out "with the local
Goliath"...Whether this is true or not this is not restoring in
love towards the Father to repentance...this is accusatory and which
we know that having the revelation of the Red Dragon/Leviathan we
should even more be on guard from imitating in words and deeds (pride)...
Next...
"Pray for
nuclear war. Pray for hurricanes and earthquakes. Pray for God to
kill 2/3 of the planet. Pray that God would humble all the false
"apostles". Pray that God would do WHATEVER it takes to
make us broken and contrite and useful for HIS purposes. Pray HIS
will and repent that we haven't been in His will all along! THAT is
what it is going to bring revival! And that is NOT the kind of
praying that the leadership at "The Call" will likely endorse!"
To tell people to
pray for these kinds of disasters doesn't seem biblical to me as a
prayer...I don't see the apostles praying this way...I think we
should pray God #1 in the Spirit in tongues...and anything we pray in
our own understanding should be to ask God to have mercy, to help
deliver those who are under satan's captivity, pray for them to
repent, and let God decide how HE will bring that about as a result
of our praying...Now I know that God will speak words of judgments
through his servants warning and declaring for reasons of not
repenting and doing our own thing and not rightly representing Him
leading multitudes astray...But I don't see this as a kind of prayer
to pray on people that are under the spirit of Leviathan...I don't
want to pray for people to die without Jesus...I love people...and I
pray that they will repent and that they will come to see the truth
and get free even if people are dying under their own destruction
coming upon them...Jesus died on the cross when we all were sinning
and doing our own thing...Jesus was God's mercy and Judgement for
sin... Mercy triumphs over judgement...if God decides to send these
kinds of things upon men it is His absolute mercy and judgement
flowing together...But I don't pray for God to do these things to
anyone...I pray that God would show mercy and help deliver them...I
remind Him of Jesus and Him crucified for our sin...and if it is
God's will to release this kind of thing upon men then that is HIS
righteous decision and I will accept that...
Next...
"You're
welcome to contact me. I'm glad to meet with you. I'll tell you what
has happened. I'll tell you what God has shown me about revival and
Kansas City and all the people that have come before and the mistakes
that were made and the City Church and what God really wants and what
it's going to take to get Him to pour His Spirit out on all flesh.
He's given me the keys. And NOW is the time. All that's left is
whether you are going to repent and help - or if He is going to
steamroll over you. But He IS going to fulfill His promises to Kansas
City. Nobody, not me or you or Andrew or anybody, is going to get in
His way this time. I'm calling everyone that has been a part of this
mess and participated in your ministries to repent so that we can go
forward together and turn Kansas City around."
When we speak a
corrective word or a rebuke...when we expose the deceptions that
others are caught in it is ALWAYS best to not tell them in the same
breath that God has given US something they don't have...THAT becomes
a major hindrance in the one being rebuked from even barely hearing
the rebuke...It has to be totally God and NONE of us...it is not
becoming to exalt ourselves in the presence of one just being
demoted...this reaks of boasting....I don't think you intentionally
meant to but it slipped in there none the less...
1 Cor 13:4 Love
endures long {and} is patient and kind; love never is envious {nor}
boils over with jealousy, is not boastful {or} vainglorious, does not
display itself haughtily. 1 Cor 13:5 It is not conceited (arrogant
and inflated with pride); it is not rude (unmannerly) {and} does not
act unbecomingly. Love (God's love in us) does not insist on its own
rights {or} its own way, {for} it is not self-seeking; it is not
touchy {or} fretful {or} resentful; it takes no account of the evil
done to it [it pays no attention to a suffered wrong]. 1 Cor 13:6 It
does not rejoice at injustice {and} unrighteousness, but rejoices
when right {and} truth prevail. 1 Cor 13:7 Love bears up under
anything {and} everything that comes, is ever ready to believe the
best of every person, its hopes are fadeless under all circumstances,
and it endures everything [without weakening]. 1 Cor 13:8 Love never
fails [never fades out or becomes obsolete or comes to an end].
This section you
wrote in your letter just has a very proud sound to it and it really
turned me off...The section I highlighted in green is questionable
that is why I highlighted...I know what your point is but isn't there
a better way to word it...I'm not saying take the sting of the rebuke
out I'm talking about wording it in a way that doesn't come across as
God doesn't love this person anymore and his despised as a
person...Like maybe it would have been better to say, God will do His
will and you will lose your priveledge of being used by Him to give
it to those who will obey ALL His commands as He did with Saul to
David...It is always better to speak respectful to those being
rebuked by God...Even if it is true that God has given you the keys
it is NEVER gracious to tell those who are losing their kingdom (so
to speak) that we are receiving it in their place...in other words
don't toot your own horn leave that for God to do....let the light of
Christ's goodness, meekness, lowliness in mind, love, and good works
shine in us so that they will see Him and not what God is doing for
us and not them through our own mouth...that is what children
do...other than those few things the rest seem to witness to me of
what God is doing...Just want you to be aware of pride creeping in
unaware in yourself...that is what happened to Andrew...it starts out
small but eventually left unchecked it will have devestating results...
Love you
brother...God Bless...
Candy
++++++++++
Subject:
RE: Letter to Mike Bickle - Solemn Warning about "The Call"
From: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Date:
Fri, June 29, 2007 8:08 pm
To: "Candy"
Hi Candy,
Thanks for your
feedback. I'll take it to the Lord.
I have tried to
focus my argument on one very simple fact. The Lord didn't want me to
get into a long debate about "Harp and Bowl" or
"dominionism" or whatever. There are other people that can
correct his theology. They can insist they are reading the Bible
correctly. You get no where that way.
In fact, I might
rather have those kinds of discussions, but they are pointless. The
Lord made it clear that the way I was to position the rebuke was
simply the fact that Mike was told to do something, it still isn't
done, and God has had to raise up other people to do it. And there is
no way for me to say that except coming from a position of being one
of the people to whom God has revealed what He wants.
So I know what
you're saying, but I hope you can see that this is Godly wisdom
because it's unarguable. There is no defense against it. They can
tell me they have higher revelation, they have purer theology,
whatever. But they can't argue with me about the FACT that God called
me to do what hasn't been done yet, but was assigned to them. That is
a trump card. Unfortunately, it makes me sound prideful. But it also
forces a showdown of the highest order. I have no option left other
than "You build your altar, I'll build my altar and we'll see
which catches fire first."
Pleasant
theological conversations would be nice, but the Lord says to push
all the chips out onto the table and bet it all on God. And Mike is
not the Goliath, the ruling spirits down there that are oppressing
him, the system of antichrist and man that has been built is the
Goliath. He'll take it personally, but then, that comment was in my
newsletter to my little list, not to him.
I love you. I'm in
a hurry, but I'll spend more time prayerfully considering your
feedback. Thanks.
Doug
{IN FACT: I
was told last night that my use of the word "Goliath" was
prophetic because that's the EXACT
word that Paul Cain spoke repeatedly before an IHOP conference before leaving
Kansas City several years ago.
That a "Goliath" was coming. He also said that he
was sent to minister to the "David Company" and he had NOT
yet met them!
At least that is the report I got from someone that heard the audio
of that event.}
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Email from
"Ben" - 7/25/07
Greetings. I
happened to stumble across your video for a call to repentance for
Mike Bickle. First I want to say that I am a fully devoted follower
of Jesus Christ. I live to please Him in everything I do and I
greatly desire purity and unity in the body of believers. With that
said, I have to say that I disagree with your perspective on the
matter concerning this man. But my opinion does not matter. In
Yeshua's first public sermon recorded he says "beware of false
prophets that come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are
ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruit." Mike Bickle
and his ministry has bore good fruit. I have no idea why you say that
he has done great harm to believers. Were you personally offended by
him or his ministry? If so, fine. But let us move on and keep our
eyes fixed solely on Jesus. Let us not stray to the right or to the
left. If Mr. Bickle has done wrong, let us have faith that our
Creator will judge rightly.
Be blessed.
B
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|
Negative
Responses
(You
ready for this? Count the cost before you tell God He can do whatever
He wants with you!) |
Subject: Re:
WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Fri, June 29, 2007 6:18 pm
To: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
sorry my freind
just read your letter and seems to me that the acusser is useing you
bigtime ,like you said strong lies that people beleiveand besides
that Jesus is the one that washs and cleanses the bride not you nor i
not mike so stop thinking God has chosen you to get the body in
orderso may i sugest something to you it will work
WALK IN LOVE OR BE
DISTROYED WE ARE COMANDED TO LOVE CAN YOU DO THAT? IF NOT YOU
WILL BE DISTROYED
+++++++
From: <doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com>
To:
"burninglamp ministry"
Sent: Saturday,
June 30, 2007 3:04 AM
Subject: Re: WALK
IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
OK, so the Word of
God doesn't mean what it says? We're not to be instant in season and
out of season with a correction or a rebuke. We're not to obey I
Timothy 5:20 and publicly rebuke elders who sin so that others will
take note? How many verses do you want? It's not about washing the
body clean it's about OBEYING GOD. And God said to call for repentance.
I'm not sure what
exactly your point is, which makes it obvious to me that it's not the
Lord speaking through you. Are you denying the truth of my statement?
Are you asserting that we're not to rebuke those who sin publicly?
Are you denying my call to do so? Or you don't think anybody
should judge or rebuke anybody because we should leave it to the Holy
Spirit, in which case, why are YOU rebuking me?
I understand very
clearly that if we don't walk in love we will be destroyed. In fact,
many in the "church" are already dead inside and don't even
know it.
God told Mike to
restore the City Church. It isn't done. God has reassigned the job to
others over and over. God says Mike needs to repent. Mike's not
listening to God, so God sent me to tell him.
If you could be
more specific about what it is EXACTLY that God told you to tell me,
it would be a lot more helpful.
Love you.
Doug
++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 9:49 am
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
DONT IT SAY IF YOU
SEE A BROTHER IN SIN YOU WHO ARE SPIRITUAL ARE TO RESTORE A BROTHER
IN A MANNER OF MEEKNESS LESS YOU FALL, IT
SEEMS THAT YOUR PRIDE AND BITTERNESS IS IN YOUR WAY AND
YOU HAVE SOME SELFISH AMBITION, LET ME BE FRANK WITH YOU I DONT
KNOW HIM NEVER HEARD HIM PREACH AND DONT CARE TO FOLLOW HIM NOR YOU I
FOLLOW JESUS ITS NOR YOUR JOB TO
FIX THE CHURCH ITS JESUS
JOB
, HES KNOWS HOW SCREWED UP YOU ARE IF YOU WOULD ADMIT IT AND HOW
SCREWED UP THE CHURCH IS , BUT I WARN YOU IF YOU CONTINUE TO POINT
THE FINGER YOU WILL REAP WHAT YOU SOW AND IT WONT BE FUN, WHY DONT
YOU GO WASH HIS FEET PUPLICLY AND REPENT TO HIM FOR THE DAMAGE YOU
BROUGHT BE SLAUDERING HIM AND FALSELY ACCUSSING HIM, YOU ARE
COMANDED BY THE KING TO LOVE ONE ANOTHER AND THE REASON YOUR CANT
LOVE HIM IS SELFISH YOU WANT A FOLLOWING JUST LIKE YOUR FREIND
ANDREW BLIND LEADERS OF THE
BLIND SO TAKE ANDREW WITH YOU TO
NASHVILLE AND REPENT TO ALL THE YOUTH THERE THAT ARE CRYING OUT FOR
HELP FROM HEAVEN NOT HELP FROM YOU SORRY I AN NOT YOUR TICKLING EAR
PREACHER SO AGAIN I SAY WALK IN LOVE OR BE
DISTROYED IF YOU DONT KNOW HOW THEN YOU ARE NOT JESUS DICIPLEAND NEED
TO BE BORN AGAIN
BLESSING ACTS 3:25-26
++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 10:22 am
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
IT SAIDS RESTORE
SUCH A ONE IN THE MANNER OF MEEKNESS NOT
PRIDE SO IF YOU DONT THINK GOD IS SPEAKING
THROUGH ME JUST WAIT TILL YOU WAIT UP IN HELL WALK IN LOVE OR
BE DISTROYED GET RID OF BITTERNESS , ENVY, JEALOUSY,
STRIFE, ARE YOU JEALOUS BECAUSE HIS CHURCH IS BOGGER THEN YOURS
OF MAYBE HE GETS MORE ATTENTION THEN YOU OF MAYBE YOU JUST WANT TO BE
LIFED UP ON A HIGHER PULPIT???????
++++++++
From: <doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com>
To:
"burninglamp ministry"
Sent: Saturday,
June 30, 2007 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: WALK
IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
Can't you see that
if this is a "word from the Lord" you are delivering to me,
that you yourself are violating it as you speak? Why don't you come
wash my feet? Why don't you repent for making false accusations? Why
aren't YOU letting Jesus fix me instead of trying to do it yourself?
And how come
you're yelling at me and not acting in love? How are you so sure YOU
aren't going to be destroyed? In fact, maybe you are already blind
and dead inside if you're completely unable to see the hypocrisy in
your own actions and words.
Thanks for your
feedback. But I'm going to have to obey God, not you. And God says
that WE have responsibility for the mess we've made of the church and
WE need to speak truth in love and fix it.
I'll be praying
for you.
Doug
++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 10:26 am
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
FIRST OF ALL YOU
INVADED MY SPACE I DIDNT ASK YOU TO SEND ME YOUR LETTER OF REBULK AND
IF IT WAS GOD WHY DO YOU HAVE TO LET EVERYONE KNOW YOUR INTENT SO I
SUGEST YOU LEARN TO READ YOUR BIBLE IT SAIDS RECEIVE WITH
MEEKNESS THE ENGRAFTED WORD OF GOD YOU SEEM TO RECEIVE WITH
BITTERNESS AND ITS SPEWING OUT OF YOUR MOUTH JUST LIKE THE DRAGON IN
REV 12 SO BACK OFF SATAN IN THE NAME OF JESUS I KNOW THE
ACCUSER WHEN I HEAR IT
+++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
Fom:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 10:32 am
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Ok tell me
sir who are you and what is it you r crying
about???? first of all lou engle is one of the most
efective men i know when it comes to a cry, but it seems you
are just crying over bitter grapes and not crying after Gods heart so
please tell me of your great wisdom on repentence and what it means i
have readandrews wrings and its bitter with envy and
jealousy be clear about your intentions,and motives God
judges the heart so be quick to hear and slow to speak remmber that
tougue of yours has be known to get you in trouble james 3
+++++++
From: <doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com>
To:
"burninglamp ministry"
Sent: Saturday,
June 30, 2007 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: WALK
IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
As far as I can
tell, you are not on my mailing list. So, if your peace was
disturbed, please take it up with whoever forwarded my email to you.
It didn't come from me.
I'm am not crying
about anything other than that God's glory would fall and repenting
that it hasn't ALREADY FALLEN because of all the times we have gone
our own way.
I am not poking at
leaders indescriminately. I was specifically told by God to make the
statement I made about Mike Bickle. The Call is not a holy fast and
it's not a sacred assembly. Some of the leadership involved are
praying that revival would come SO THAT they can walk in the power of
God and heal and raise the dead and build big ministries. The motive
is wrong. They want revival on THEIR terms. Some of these are
Dominionists that believe the world will be under a one world
Christian government ruled by 35 SuperApostles that speak for God and
can't be questioned - of which they count themselves in that number.
Particularly C. Peter Wagner is behind much more than people realize.
I do not want a
big pulpit. I have no need for wealth. I am not particularly enjoying
this. There is no joy in rebuking a brother. At least there should
not be. And yet, it is necessary at times. We just have to do it with
fear and trembling and out of a desire to see them free from the
things that are ruling over them that take their eyes off of Jesus.
It's very simple.
God wants a restored city church in Kansas City. God told Bickle to
do it. Bickle did it wrong, hurt a lot of people, admitted it and
repented. But stopped trying! God is still trying to find a man that
can go. God has been trying in Kansas City for almost 200 years!! I
can speak with authority on this because God told me to do the same
things God told Bickle. WHY? Why did God tell me to do those things
except that they remain undone? And if God told Bickle to do them and
they remain undone, then shouldn't he repent? AND God told Andrew
Strom to do them, and they remain undone.
It's just an
obvious fact. If God sent someone to bring revival to Kansas City and
there is not yet revival in Kansas City, then they need to say their
sorry for having missed the mark. The blood of thousands or millions
of people is on their head.
You don't get
revival until you say you're sorry for being the kind of people that
need REVIVING!! You don't get a fresh fire until you say you're sorry
for all the times He tried to light it and YOU BLEW IT OUT!
And you can't
repent for your country with authority while your own city is in
ruins. Jerusalem, Judaea, Samaria and the ends of the earth. You
really shouldn't go to the ends of the earth to tell them how to
bring revival when Jerusalem is dead!! Fix your own town first! Then
you'll have authority to speak about revival on a wider scale. Break
the yokes here. Feed the hungry here. Do Isaiah 58 at home!
The Call is not a
fulfillment of Isaiah 58. It's not the fast the Lord wants. And the
people going don't have authority to pray for revival in America
until they have brought revival to the Body of Christ in their own
cities. The messages to the churches in Revelation (and throughout
the Bible) are always to WHOLE CITIES. Not the nation, not the
elders, not a bishop of Asia Minor. Those who love Jesus in a city.
I want what God
wants. And He wants the false shepherds that are taking the people
away from His Model to sit down and shut up. We don't have time for
singing and dancing while people are dying.
There ya go.
Thanks for listening. Feel free to ask me anything.
Doug
++++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 12:31 pm
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Do you test and
judge the hearts of men is it you who gives salvation
? I see God has chosen you to bring revival hasnt
he?? i see God has forgotten his comand that you love one
another as i have loved you or maybe you are above obeying his
comands didnt he say and the greastest of these is love, for you to
say the call mike bickle lou engle and the fast is not issaiah
58 neither is the pointing of the finger so that YOUR voice would be
heard on high repant me freind and try reading GENESIS 4;5-8
IAM AM FROM THE CITY OF BROTHERLY LOVE REPENT AND WALK IN LOVE
OR BE DISTROYED PSALMS133
+++++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 1:09 pm
To:
"burninglamp ministry"
OK, I get ya. Yell
and scream at the guy that God sends to call for repentance. Yeah,
yeah. I'm used to it. You just keep right on threatening and cursing
people. I'm just going to keep listening to God and not to Man.
I love you, too.
Doug
+++++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 8:08 pm
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
SO tell me
what is repentence and how do you do it ohh great secret agent???
+++++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 1:09 pm
To:
"burninglamp ministry"
You're the prophet
that gets to rebuke everybody. Ask Jesus.
I have lots of
people that need real ministry and healing. It's not good stewardship
of my time to take attention away from them to argue.
Love you,
Doug
++++++++++++++++
Subject:
Re: WALK IN LOVE OR BE DISTROYED
From:
"burninglamp ministry"
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 9:36 pm
To: doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
sir you seem to be
the one who want to cause contention in the body of christ and you
still havent gotten the message its WALK IN LOVE OR BE
DISTROYED BLESSINGS OR CURSES YOU CHOOSE TRY
READING JAMES 3 AND 4 SO I WILL NOT MATCH WITS WITH
UNARMED PEOPLE SO REPENT AND WALK IN LOVE YOU SEEM
LIKE A YOUNSTER FULL OF RELIGOUS
ZEAL I HAVE A FREIND WHO
SEND U LETTER TO DAVID RAVENHILL HE SAIDS YOU HAVE A PERSONAL
AGENDA AND NEED TO GROW UP AND MOVE ON GOOD
DAY YOUNG MAN
++++++++++++++
HEY! Look at
that folks! My letter is really
making the rounds!!
:-)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Comment on
YouTube - 6/27/07
Doug - I am sorry
bud but I think you have this wrong. I listened to your message which
I am sure is heart felt but I think you have been taken off track. I
have listened to lots of the teaching at IHOP from the UK and have
visited a couple of times. They teach Pray & Fast, Read your
bible, love Jesus, Give to the Poor - I can live by this!!!!!!!!!!
Where you are coming from I dont know!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Subject:
ihop
From:
"Lowell"
Date:
Fri, June 29, 2007 11:26 pm
To: fotm@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Hi,
I just read
your "letter" to Mike Bickle and IHOP and couldn't
help but respond. The Lord really used IHOP and Mike to
straighten up my life. My heart had really grown cold to the
Lord and I was really struggling: then I found IHOP and Mike
Bickle. Their themes of the Bridal paradigm and intimacy really
opened up my eyes and I drew closer to the Lord in my short time
there than I had for years elsewhere. Every time that Mike
spoke, the Holy Spirit was dealing with me on the same issues that
Mike was speaking about; it was really quite amazing. My life
has truly changed for the better and I will never go back to the old
way of living. I think that I am going to hit up one of the
internships and go on fulltime staff there next year. I really
could fill a rather large book with all the testimonials of how I and
hundreds that I know completely dedicated and rededicated our lives
to the Lord through this ministry. Sometimes I go into the prayer
room for hours just seeking the Lord. It definitely has one of
the most annointed atmospheres of anywhere I have ever been.
It's just easy to draw close to God there. My father says that
it is the same way at the wailing wall in Jerusalem. We think
that it has something to do with prayer going up 24/7 there.
In Christ,
Lowell
P. S. Looks
like you have some unresolved bitterness here?
+++++++++++++++++
Subject:
Re: ihop
From:
doug@fellowshipofthemartyrs.com
Date:
Sat, June 30, 2007 2:03 am
To: "Lowell"
Hi Lowell,
Thanks for
writing. I'm glad God is moving in your life. Keep seeking Jesus.
I have no
unresolved bitterness. I've never met Mike, never been to a
conference, never read any of his books. Not been hurt by him other
than the fact that he was sent to restore the Church of Kansas City
and it's not restored yet.
I'm not saying
that he never heard God. I'm not saying everything there is of satan.
I'm saying there are SOME things that God told him to do that remain
undone. Even if you are 75% right on, the other 25% is outright
rebellion and will result in missed opportunities, curses on people
around you and blood on your head.
My job is not to
estimate or judge how much there is error and how much is God. My job
is to say what the Lord told me to say, which is the undeniable fact
that God told Mike to do some stuff twenty years ago that remains
undone - and God has been raising up people to do it. And because
Mike didn't obey, there is a strong delusion and blindness and
spiritual pride on the people that make him and idol and set the IHOP
above the rest of the Body of Christ in Kansas City. We are ONE and
we need to start acting like it.
There is more info
on the page on my site about what exactly happened and what Mike was
called to do. Maybe you should research. I appreciate your loyalty,
but it should be to JESUS who saved you and to Truth. Mike
didn't get up on a cross for you. That last prayer Jesus prayed
before the Cross was that we would be ONE - and we're not one. And
God told Mike to do something about it - and he made it too much
about himself instead.
Thanks for your
feedback. Thanks for listening. May the Lord Jesus Christ richly
bless you with a bigger cup of Him.
Doug Perry
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Comment on
YouTube from MasterXploder 7/3/07
i just wasted 15
minutes of my life listening to this and your other warped
"message" about mike bickle and IHOP. if you are talking
about public correction to the body, this is appropriate that i tell
you that you are COMPLETELY out of line. one, you are causing
division in the body.
i dont care who
you are talking about, but if you are causing division in the body
i'm positive God hates that more than a group of people coming
together to pray for and fast for change in our nation in the
government and in the church. two, your words are out of context.
you're saying that we can't change things in our nation or in a
different state because we dont live there?!
you are the
deceived one.. that's like saying our prayers for relatives in the
war won't be answered because we dont live in iraq! people like you
that claim to follow God and do "His will" drive the lost
away from the Truth. God loves us no matter what. God is to be feared
and reverenced, but He also loves us so much that He gave His only
Son for us. the very base of the Bible IS love.
i personally feel
that you are acting no better that Westboro Baptist Church in iowa,
that is saying God hates gays and that He is going to destroy us.
sending a negative message to all of the lost viewing believers as
crazy people. if you have something with mike bickle or lou engle,
write them a letter or call them somehow
don't post it on
here for everyone in the world to see except them, i mean, really.
i'm not coming against you with hatred, but this does upset me and i
feel very sad that you would discourage people from pressing in to
seek God.
oh, and a heads
up.. no one ever said come see, God is here, this is where you have
to be. no one ever said i have found Him here He is. however, people
HAVE gone to IHOP and found His presence there and have come back to
my city changed and with new revelation, with opened eyes and passion
for the hurting, lost, and dying.
this is not a
conference to say "look how awesome we are" it is a sincere
cry for God to bring justice to this nation and for Him to grip the
hearts of a dying generation. that sounds completely God to me, not
man. again, this is about correction, not hatred for anyone.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Email from
"Caroline" - 7/5/07
Hello there, my
name is Caroline (last name deleted), and I heard about your
website and I listened to your video on "youtube"
concerning The Call.
I am appalled at
what I heard. I am going to "The Call" and I know beyond a
shadow of a doubt that God is going to move through this nation. I
dont understand how you can say that The Call in un-holy, or un-pure.
IHOP is a FANTASTIC ministry, and I would really like to know where
you draw your information from. Yes, I to believe that God can meet
us anywhere, but I dont really think that you understand the real
meaning of The Call. Most of your facts are wrong, and like I
mentioned earlier, I was truely appalled at what I heard. And at the
very end of your video, you said that you will take full
responsibility of this word and any damage done to the body of
Christ, so I hope you are ready to do that. This is calling from the
Lord. Like I said you have many of your facts wrong, and are severly
mislead. I cannot believe what you said about Mile Bicle, and IHOP.
They are a great ministry and is not cursed!!!!! I cannot believe you
said that God doesnt want to hear our prayers. Sir, you are really
mislead about The Call, the people behind it, the purpose of The
Call, and what we are trying to do there. Thank you for listening.
If you have
questions or would like to discuss thsi further, I would love to talk
with you. But I WILL BE AT THE CALL THIS WEEKEND, AND I HAVE FAITH
THAT OUR NATION IS ABOUT TO GO THROUGH A SERIOUS REVIVAL. GOD HAS NOT
FORGOTTEN AMERICA, AND IT IS NOT TO LATE. HE IS A GOD FULL OR MERCY,
COMPASSION AND GRACE. HE IS READY TO MOVE, AND ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS
THAT YOU BETTER BE READY, HE'S GONNA MOVE AND MOVE BIG!! PRAISE THE LORD!!!
-Caroline
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Email from
"Gedy" - 8/4/07
Brother,
I pray that the
truth of Jesus Christ will be revealed to you. I am a product
of the IHOP ministry. Don't use God's Word to justify your
sins. I am very sad to know that you are sharing this with so
many. Know that God will surely hold you accountable for what
you are doing.
In Christ,
Gedy
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Email from
"Adam" - 8/8/07
God is not angry.
God Loves you.
God is not a steamroller.
God is your Husband
He loves
you....He's not waiting for a good enough reason to wipe you out.
He is your LOVING Father.
He is your
FAITHFUL Husband.
I pray that God
would reveal Himself to you and you would see the truth of who He is,
and who you are to Him.
He loves you.
He loves you. He loves you.
Godbless
Adam
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Email from "Gary"
- 8/17/07
I listened to part
of your rebuke to Mike Bickle and my heart broke as you have totally
missed the ministry at IHOP. I fear that you will fall into the
snare that you accuse Bickle of and I urge you to repent for your
judgment of him.
Blessings,
Gary
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